Soilslave- I just got that book from the library this week! haven’t started it yet.
It’s a wonderful book, Penny. I read it during the y2k fiasco and really was struck with a different way of looking at collapse - the gradual disappearance of things in very much the way a frog doesn’t know it is dying if it is heated very slowly.
Snowflower
Penny…I’d be interested to read what your thoughts on the book are…whether your done with it or not…I hope you enjoy it…
Shit my reply got lost when I went to post it. Anyhow I finished Into the Forest and liked it a lot. I was happy that the author did not make them magically proficient and survival. I hate it when in books and movies they make things look too easy. Learning plants and stuff is hard! I also liked the portrayal of the collapse, just visualizing how it might be. I’m not sure why there were big epidemics of the flu and the measels though. It seems like it would take awhile for a disease like measels to make a comeback as long as we are still all vaccinated and that germs would spread less quickly if air and car travel stopped. It seems like a greater die off would occur because of people no longer being able to access drugs like their heart medications, and among people who were already in critical condition. Oh man have you ever stopped a medication abruptly that you were supposed to taper off of? You don’t realize how strong the drugs are. I stopped antidepressants once and I could not walk for a few days for the dizzyness and nausea. Well what do other people think about disease and hospitals and collapse?
Penny,
I think you make a really good point that the diseases that will start wiping people out (in the US, at least) are the ones that are currently being held at bay by medication rather than the ones that have been held at bay by vaccines. I think in the third world, though, that the diseases treated by vaccination have not been wiped out as much as they have here, so they might hit newborn populations pretty hard.
I haven’t heard of Into the Forest but it sounds like I should check it out.
Diabetics would be amongst the first to die-off, if the crash is a nuclear war/armageddon type thing. You would also have alot of heart patients, various transplant patients, and the abovementioned medicine people that would’nt make it very long either.
Ya’ll ever read Alas Babylon?. Pretty good apocalypse book, and very short. It is a civ book, through and through, but interesting nonetheless
I know not wether civilisation will collapse with a great noise or if it will go out slowly and a little quieter.
But over the next 5 years,I hope to become much more efficient at survival.
I also think its important to keep ourselves in as good of health as possible,
so Im gonna get out there and get exercise this summer,wether it be scouting,swimming or running,ect.
I will do an herbal cleanse, clean all that civilised deseased filth out of my bowels.
Also dont stress yourselves out to much people,peril may come soon or late,
enjoy your time here,indeed, try to be timeless.
May civilisation fall soon… Ofthewood
You may also want to think about cycling. Obviously, bikes aren’t a long-term solution, but they are efficient means of travel, and pretty good exercise to boot.
[quote=“ofthewood, post:27, topic:47”]Also dont stress yourselves out to much people,peril may come soon or late,
enjoy your time here,indeed, try to be timeless.
May civilisation fall soon… Ofthewood[/quote]
Amen! 
I am skeptic.
The Mayans rock my dreams of the collapse of civillization, however, I believe one of the reasons they were so accurately able to predict many major future events, was due to their realization that time is cyclical, not linear. If the Mayan calendar had continued past 12/21/12 we would be entering kantun 13 or 14 (I dont know if I spelled that right.) wich is a time of great upheaval and change, and an end to the word of god. The end of their calendar could indeed be percieved as their predicted end of human civilization. I just hope we don’t keep on cycling through the kantuns until we’ve choked the life out of everything else that got stuck with us here on Earth.
this will not be the end. catastrophic collapse will be when the next doubling of our population takes place, and the collapse of ecological structure.
I think getting hung up on the 2012 date is a bit of a red herring. Yes, I’m sure some significant event will occur that speeds up collapse then, but then something will also happen in 2011, and something else in 2013, and so forth. Sure, the mayan calender, whatever. What makes their prediction of the end any more valid than the myths of any other culture?
I’ve also read that the mayan calender’s end date was supposed to be when the sun crossed the galactic plane. And it was off, because the shift happened in 1999. I think that given the range of dates involved, and the observations necessary, that’s pretty good.
I’m sure something will happen in 2008 as well, maybe even 2007. This is only the beginning of the end.
I am not a religious man pertaining myself the title atheist but if there was ever a time to pray, doing so in regards to the end of this nightmare I believe would only be logical.
Hello.
I am new to the forum, and just thought I would share a few things with you.
2012 is the major date predicted for the end of the world. Not only the Mayans, but look also at the the bible code, Merlin(The actual merlin was a seer and merlin means crazy man of the woods) , prohpeycs of Nostredamus (In which the end of the world will be soon after 2012)
For those of you who dont know, the bible code is a quite recent discovery. There was a bible researcher (Jewish) who lived in Jermany during WWII. He became obbsessed with the notion that there were secret dates and prohphycs hidden the the original hebrew text of the bible. Just He claimed to have made a major breakthrough, he was sent to a concentration camp and died shortly. In 1990, A group of researchers set out to prove that there was no actual bible code, but inetvertandly broke it. 9/11 was predicted, the location of the ark was predicted, several hurricanes and Tsunamis were predicted. When researching the end of the world, they came up with two conflicting statements. The first read, “2012, a meteor will hit the earth, dooming all and killing all.” the second reads, “2012, A meteor heads to the earth. I will destroy it, Smashing it from the sky.”
Either way, several civilizations, indigionous people, unrelated phrophets and seers have all predicted the end of the world. I hope to go over the prophecys of Merlin, Nostredamus, and others with you soon, but unfortinitly, I cannot find any verbatum qoutes, and my memory is not good enough for it. However, there are sevral others out there.
Edit
(I decided to add the prophecys of nostredamus)
So Nostredamus predicted that the end of the world would be proceeded by three anti-christs. The first was Napoleon Bonoparte, The second was Adolf Hitler, and the third is still under some dispute. I will simply cut and paste the actual verses and allow you to decide your own veiws.
Out of the country of Greater Arabia Shall be born a strong master of Mohammed,
He will enter Europe wearing a blue turban.
He will be the terror of mankind.
Never more horror
In the year 1999 and seven months
From the sky will come the great King of Terror.
He will bring back to life the King of the Mongols;
Before and after war reigns.
The war will last seven and twenty years.
The sky will burn at forty-five degrees.
Fire approaches the great new city
By fire he will destroy their city,
A cold and cruel heart,
Blood will pour,
Mercy to none
When those of the Northern Pole are united,
In the East will be great fear and dread…
One day the two great leaders will be friends;
Their great powers will be seen to grow.
The New Land will be at the height of its power:
To the man of blood the number is reported.
Your thoughts?
I think that I didn’t apply critical thinking to the myths of human progress merely to blindly accept the myths of long dead “seers” half remembered.
how can a war last ‘seven and twenty years’ beginning in 1999 if everyone dies in 2012? besides, bin laden wears a white turban, but bush wears a Ranger’s cap? anyway.
I have some useful information I recently obtained on the subject.
The end of the mayan universe doesn’t exist. It goes on forever. At most, archeologists can determine that the suns equitorial traversing over the ‘dark spot’ that runs through the galactic core would be an intense period of social enlightenment.
Let me through the actual physics your way.
New agers claim that the sun enters the dark spot on the winter solstice in 2012. that is not true. That is based of a new agers account that the long count began when he said it began. In truth, the beginning of the long count has been counted backwards and verified by remaining living indigineous mayan astrologists, cross-refferenced with conquistador writings. The traverse of the sun through the dark spot of the galaxy actually began in 1980, fully entered the space in 1999, and will fully leave the space in 2116. So techinically, the age of mayan (not new-agey pseudo aztec-mayan) enlightenment began when I was born! see, I am quetzacoatl, here to exterminate (or save — could it be the same thing?) everylast mutherfucker in the room. Quetzalcoatl, accept no substitutions…
Anyway. The gravity of the stars are not destiny. Eating ice cream doesn’t make you fat, but moving into an ice cream factory does. LIving astrology will give it total control of your life. Understanding it and taking it as it comes, and watching it push and pull the waters of this earth (HOW much water is in your body???) is another thing. YOu can be the fish in the water, or the water yourself. You decide.
in response to treedeer
I would not look at anything like the ‘bible code’ or other ‘seers’ or prophets or whatever, especially in a religious prophetic sense, mainly as the bible tells to beware of false prophets, if a ‘prophet’ makes even one telling that does not come true, or has to change his/her prophesy… than they are a false prophet.
Personally as far as prophecy goes I think revelations is looking quite right.
I was (am) educated by jesuits, and one of the things that they attempted to pound into our head was that revelations is not real. You need to look at it in in context (I am a animist by the way). At the time it was written, the kingdom of god (or heaven as we like to calll it today) was not a afterlife, but a actuall physical place (nation) on the map that was supposed to materilize by the chosen ones. That is actually the reason that jesus was executed, the romans were afraid he would start a revoloution. Relivations was actually more of a giant recruitment tool. If you ask a preist, most will say that the bible is a human work with human inconsistencies and human errors. I have noticed that you qoute the bible quite alot, and I would recomend talking to a jesuit or a member of a simaler order.
Hmm, the thing is I know a lot about the Kingdom of God / Kingdom of Heaven concept, it’s actually the gospel of the NT. It’s also one of the main reasons I picked up the bible again.
The the thing is Jesus came or whatever at precisely the time when the best model of the Kingdom was visible, via the Roman Empire.
Concerning revelations, I am either at the point where it is ‘divine’ or else if it’s not my guess would be that it is so influenced into the people behind the scene (or from them (past)) that the events (many at least) on it will indeed happen for simply that reason.
Anyhow I’ve only quoted it twice, and both concerning the same subject, just because in the light of things I think its important.
And imho I’m not about to put my stock in Jesuits either, even if they did rewrite history.
Anyhow this doesn’t have much to do with 2012 so I will make a new post called revelations if anyone would like to discuss that