The Lone Mountain Man


#21

I am always looking for others who would want to be involved in some kind of desert "tribe’ in the near future. I am pretty much sold on the desert as opposed to other ecoregions for many practical and personal reasons and for the fact that I have never felt so close or at home with other people and the land other than in the desert. Maybe I am idealistic and such but I basically would like to live with others in a similar way to how I have lived with the Bedouin as it’s the closest I have come to a perfect social arrangement. I would prefer to base the economics more around hunting with a little herding rather than herding with a little hunting if the ecoregion allows for it, at least that is what I am striving for at this point in time.

I do think some small scale goat or camel herding can be helpful to contributing to the meat supply and weeding people off the grocery store , and what percentage of importance herding or permaculture/gardening would take among a small group of people living together after some time I can’t really say and it would depend alot on the available fauna/flora of the desert and whether the people involved would be interested in hunting for all of their protein needs. However until that decision is made a few goats, chickens or the like can help feed you and your friends as you hone your hunting skills and allow for less dependence on store-bought meat.

Basically having spent time with modern tribal peoples one really gets a feel for what is possible between people; economically, socially, spiritually. Sure no modern or historic tribe is or was ever perfect, but there is a huge big noticeable difference to me how people can connect when they are living “tribally” and “together” “for each other” out in camps or otherwise out on the land as opposed to how they don’t connect when they are "living as strangers"in settlements and not sharing food, not sharing experiences, not contributing to each other socially, economically, spiritually.

Prior to 2005 I would have thought that maybe people living together in some tribal-type communal situation wouldn’t be practical in this day and age or that it was just romanticism but once I experienced life among modern day tribal peoples my whole outlook changed because I was seeing it and experiencing it right in front of me. It wasn’t perfect but it was much closer to my heart and soul than any other social arrangement I have participated in.

And it is just those satisfying human communal experiences that make all the difference in meeting one’s needs, IMO. Hunting with others, feasting with others and basically sharing the beautiful desert land with others has been the best of times for me. Nothing can match those experiences except for similar experiences. Only in the desert living that life have I ever said to myself “Yea I am perfectly content with life right now” or “This is how I should be living” etc etc. Times like slaughtering goats and sharing the meat around the fire at night everyone sitting around in a circle, going out hunting with other men walking for hours driving a little rabbit toward those armed with weapons and then cooking the rabbit and everyone having a share in it even though it’s only a little meat for everyone’s portion, bringing home some desert pigeons to share with my friend’s family and preparing and cooking and eating them together, spending time telling stories at night and camping out under the stars beside my close friends.

It’s always a learning experience when I can share a small part of these experiences with another or several other persons. Going alone isn’t something that fulfills the human needs, I think we are more like wolves, we are evolved to share the life with each other.


#22

I agree. I think we are taught that we don’t “need” certain “needs.” Social connection being the ultimate example. We are taught that indirect, mediated, watered down, distant social relationships are “just the way it is” and “normal.” Ha! No, they’re a freakish aberration from 2+ million years of human existence.


#23

I may be a little late as this thread seems resolved. But although I agree that tribal life is just natural and desirable, I want to mention an example of a civilized man who went really Wild not for a winter or two but a lifetime.
It was 7 or 8 years ago that in deserts near Isfahan a man named Darab was found who had abandoned civ for 30 years to live a stone age life, so alone that he had almost forgotten language. Anyway he was seized (!), fled once, captured a second time and again fled and no one heard of him again.
And Hey SandWalker, Sometimes I feel like a silly dreamer but it’s heartening to hear about another uncompromising rewilder with concrete plans. Viel Glueck!


#24

hmm, that’s very interesting.

how sad is it that he was seized? i mean, what the hell for, you know?


#25

Well he was arrested because, you know, civilization cannot tolerate other forms of life. And here that it’s not law that civ. men read, they alarm when something abnormal happens, and they just cannot tolerate it. I guess there too they would arrest all the rewilders if they could. I think they sue you because of let’s say smoking joints for the same reason. it’s civility anyway.


#26

Mountain Refugee, do agree. Yes when one thinks about it, how much
would the Powers That Be arrest all of us rewilders in my opinion also.

Also talking about this one that they tried to arrest but got away. This
happened several years ago here in Northwest Wyoming. Now someone
had left and gone into the mountain wilds and was living. The authorities
heard about him and later caught him and arrested him. And one of the
charges was poaching. Interesting just how much in agreement does
those in our barbaric society don’t tolerate in any form those that go
beyond and against it’s barabaric so called civilized ways.

Thanks for sharing.


#27
I may be a little late as this thread seems resolved. But although I agree that tribal life is just natural and desirable, I want to mention an example of a civilized man who went really Wild not for a winter or two but a lifetime. It was 7 or 8 years ago that in deserts near Isfahan a man named Darab was found who had abandoned civ for 30 years to live a stone age life, so alone that he had almost forgotten language. Anyway he was seized (!), fled once, captured a second time and again fled and no one heard of him again. And Hey SandWalker, Sometimes I feel like a silly dreamer but it's heartening to hear about another uncompromising rewilder with concrete plans. Viel Glueck!

Hey Mountain refugee, where did you get the info about this guy? I looked on the net but couldn’t get any information about him. Btw, where are you from? Thanks for the support, I hope to realize more goals/plans in the near future and share the experiences with other like-minded people.


#28

I and Darab both come from Iran. I searched persian and couldn’t find anything too. I’ll try to find the newspaper I read about him in 8 years ago, since I guess he is the only known example of a complete civ. goes wild. The only thing I remember about him is that he would trim his hair and beard with fire, and that he was not a deliberate skillfull rewilder, he just went wild.

This interests me much as it proves that stone age skills have become somehow instinctive over the course of hundreds of thousands of years.

My own experience taught me if I manage to ignore the long accepted assumptions of civ. mind (as Knowing before Doing, or Expecting things to happen according to concrete mental images) through intimate contact with nature (prolonged silence, celebrating observation of such phenomena as sunrise and sunset, meditation on human body,…) the natural way will flow out Naturally. All this IMO means Evolution guru is waiting for a call to show the way.


#29

There was a man and his 12 year old daughter found living in Forest Park, Portland, OR, not too long ago. They had been living there for four years, had a garden, shelter, the daughter was home-schooled and had a 12th grade proficiency even though for her age she would have been in 7th grade… the police removed them from the forest, set the man up with a job, and found a trailer on a farm for them to live in, but I heard that they disappeared again… does anyone remeber this story?


#30

[quote=“mountain refugee, post:28, topic:254”]I and Darab both come from Iran. I searched persian and couldn’t find anything too. I’ll try to find the newspaper I read about him in 8 years ago, since I guess he is the only known example of a complete civ. goes wild. The only thing I remember about him is that he would trim his hair and beard with fire, and that he was not a deliberate skillfull rewilder, he just went wild.

This interests me much as it proves that stone age skills have become somehow instinctive over the course of hundreds of thousands of years.

My own experience taught me if I manage to ignore the long accepted assumptions of civ. mind (as Knowing before Doing, or Expecting things to happen according to concrete mental images) through intimate contact with nature (prolonged silence, celebrating observation of such phenomena as sunrise and sunset, meditation on human body,…) the natural way will flow out Naturally. All this IMO means Evolution guru is waiting for a call to show the way.[/quote]

Ahlan wa sahlan ya ackh (Welcome, my brother- don’t speak Farsi but know a little Arabic). The deserts of Iran with all those caves and date palms must be pretty amazing. I have to admit the Arabian peninsula is still my favorite part of the world and every time I go back there it’s like returning home. Much of it has to do with having Bedouin pals to share the life with over there. I have met some wonderful people from your country as well.

I really would like more info on this Darab guy, how he fed himself, what tools he made/used, etc so if you can find out anything at all I would enjoy reading about it. Btw, what sort of re-wilding experiments have you done over there? I would like to hear about it if that’s alright with you.


#31

Mountain Refugee said, “My own experience taught me if I manage to ignore the long accepted assumptions of civ. mind (as Knowing before Doing, or Expecting things to happen according to concrete mental images) through intimate contact with nature (prolonged silence, celebrating observation of such phenomena as sunrise and sunset, meditation on human body,…) the natural way will flow out Naturally.”

MR, I think you are touching on something that a lot of this discussion about “lone mountain men” is missing. There is a value in learning this way. I think a lot of what people are saying here is reflective of how hooked into the civilized way of learning they are. You are one of the few here who has brought up this alternative which I feel is a more “wild” way to learn.

I have been looking for a way to put this into words here and I still feel as though I’m not being very successful. I tried to touch on it in my posts in the “We don’t need another elder” thread. The modern, western, developed world, way of knowlege and learning is a big stumbling block to “rewilding”.

I don’t know how to say much more about it here but thanks MR for your posts.

I think people who venture into the natural world to attempt to allign themselves on their own should be encouraged. They can return to share what they learn with the rest of us. In many ways there are a lot of things that are for individuals to learn and get in touch with so they can be valuable contributors to larger family, clan, tribe, nation. So for you who need to go on your quest, I say thank you for doing that. I hope to see you again.


#32
I think people who venture into the natural world to attempt to allign themselves on their own should be encouraged. They can return to share what they learn with the rest of us. In many ways there are a lot of things that are for individuals to learn and get in touch with so they can be valuable contributors to larger family, clan, tribe, nation. So for you who need to go on your quest, I say thank you for doing that. I hope to see you again.

I agree. In fact I think that some things in life can only be achieved through extended periods of solitude while being in nature. I think it’s necessary for every person to spend some time alone in wildlands but as to how long or in what way people should go about it is for them to figure out.

I think it’s one of the best ways of confronting oneself and one’s problems and working through them, as well as appreciating nature and becoming more attuned to the natural world around you. For myself, I know that I would be in no condition to relate to others in a healthy way if I had not spent months living homeless on the streets and spending days and nights on my own in the forest and desert dealing with much of my “problems and issues” for several years. It was painful at first but it helped me more than I’ll ever know.

I don’t think we would have any historical record of the biblical/koranic prophets if they did not spend extended periods of time alone in nature learning, listening and allowing themselves to be open to the things they had to achieve in their lives. They had to be apart from society and get away from distractions and social busyness to have things revealed to them, and everyone has this opportunity to learn and listen when they spend time alone in wildlands.

I also think that many of those hermits and others who spend all their days in meditation know lots of things I don’t and follow a way that I will probably never fully understand, yet I respect that choice, even though I know that I am not meant to spend all of my days in solitude.

I enjoy the days when it’s just me and the animals and the desert, yet I equally enjoy the days filled with companionship and sharing. When there is a healthy mix of the two, life is good and I don’t have anything to complain about.


#33
I tried to touch on it in my posts in the "We don't need another elder" thread. The modern, western, developed world, way of knowlege and learning is a big stumbling block to "rewilding".

I think people who venture into the natural world to attempt to allign themselves on their own should be encouraged. They can return to share what they learn with the rest of us. In many ways there are a lot of things that are for individuals to learn and get in touch with so they can be valuable contributors to larger family, clan, tribe, nation.

This did it for me. Especially in reference to the whole elder thing. I find it so easy to become confused with a wealth and bombardment of knowledge, thoughts, ideas, doctrines, etc. where everyone has their own view, and everyone has the truth. Well, I think everyone has the truth, a little here, a bit there… so this following quote I read recently really makes sense. I find so much truth out there (and how do we define truth really) it becomes difficult to know ‘the truth’.

For who knows what ‘the truth’ ‘is’ so this quote (I found from Gershon Winkler, a Jewish Shaman, which quotes the Talmud, makes a lot of sense).

Religion is nice, but even without all that divine revelatory hullabaloo, the Creator left us enough information in the earth about how to live in balance... we could have learned everything we needed to know from the animals.

I guess my point lies in that everyone has their divine revelatory hullabaloo these days, should we take everyones word, or seek it for ourselves (or not selfishly for ‘oneself’ but to pass on and share as mentioned above.

so they can be valuable contributors to larger family, clan, tribe, nation.
But now ask the animals, and they will teach you; And the birds of the air, and they will tell you; Or speak to the earth, and it will teach you; And the fish of the sea will explain to you.

#34
MR, I think you are touching on something that a lot of this discussion about "lone mountain men" is missing. There is a value in learning this way.
Hey Victor! What a motivating appreciation. Thanks. But I want to say that there is nothing to learn (Learning is exactly that Knowing before Doing and I don't mean the essential skills which have to be learned) rather lots of things to forget. The Way is engraved in every human, despite knowledge or ignorance. Go into the right context where the right motivators are found and Live. No need to learn but a need to experience. I know you know all these because you have lived this way, I just wanted to phrase it better. ( I guess they call it Wu Wei in Tao, No mind, ready, action!)
I don't think we would have any historical record of the biblical/koranic prophets if they did not spend extended periods of time alone in nature learning, listening and allowing themselves to be open to the things they had to achieve in their lives
I used to wonder from where these guys had obtained their wisdom. I myself to understand them complied a full philosophical library! But they didn't. Moreover, we should not stress on tribal living so much that we forget living alone IS a part of natural life. A tribe IMO is a forum of Singles who share what they come up to (material or else) with others. That is through a tribe one human experiences life more than once. The society which denies or asks to deny the personal (single and alone, what You have experienced and nobody else)experience isn't a tribe but a city, not a community but a hierarchy. MR

#35

If the discussion of people living alone in the wilderness for prolonged periods of time is going overseas, what about the Japanese military guys who hid for decades, not realizing that the war was over?

Freeholder


#36

I think the lone mountain man image is an image of civilization.

I also think it may be ingrained in us as part of civilization’s way of tricking us into thinking that ‘rewilding’ means we must leave humanity behind.

I feel/think, fink, theel, whatever, that it has civilization’s inherent misanthropy as it’s basis.

Again, I see the trick of ‘humanity = civilization and civilization = humanity’.

I feel civilization wants us to be separate and dependent. So we have a hard time seeing that we have community in our bones and our bowels.

Reminds me of when I heard that some native peoples would consider banishment, i.e. being alone and separated as the ultimate worst reality.


#37

Nice points Wildandfreehumyn. Welcome to the boards!


#38

thanks for the welcome.


#39

Exactly, as though anybody who is on a spiritual search, or any search for something better, must leave humanity behind.


#40

[quote=“wildandfreehumyn, post:36, topic:254”]I think the lone mountain man image is an image of civilization.

I also think it may be ingrained in us as part of civilization’s way of tricking us into thinking that ‘rewilding’ means we must leave humanity behind.

I feel/think, fink, theel, whatever, that it has civilization’s inherent misanthropy as it’s basis.

Again, I see the trick of ‘humanity = civilization and civilization = humanity’.

I feel civilization wants us to be separate and dependent. So we have a hard time seeing that we have community in our bones and our bowels.

Reminds me of when I heard that some native peoples would consider banishment, i.e. being alone and separated as the ultimate worst reality.[/quote]

I agree! And I find especially interesting the part about banishment as the worst type of punishment…