Donald Trump as an Ishmaelian anti-christ

Throughout the Ishmael Trilogy, Ishmael interprets the Bible’s stories and provides historical context for the reader. The creation myth, is not of human creation but of civlizations’ creation, etc etc. I’ve taken parts of his bible story interpretations and sometimes taken them further, like, garden of eden was fabulous where humans wanted for nothing just like the “uncivilized” squirrels that pass thru my yard and also having everything they desire, friends, mates, plethora of edible food, constant supply of housing etc. If squirrels started building a technological society, they may struggle with war, poverty, control, sexism etc. This is all being hashed out in my mind because two thought exercises crossed my mind, first - I believe Ishmael is entirely accurate with early parts of the Bible he covers, but what about Revelations, Daniel, and Zeccariah, second- a Benjamin L Corey article was put out where he finds similarities between trump and the apocalyptic scriptures.
To be clear here, I do not take any part of any apocalyptic bible literal in any fashion. Use of dragons, demons, satan, etc, would all just be metaphors or period language used at the time. What I wish Daniel Quinn could have Ishmael interpret for us is, does this ending of the Bible suggest that if the absolute worst parts of civilized “mother” culture become the most planet consuming obsession, will the religion of mother culture die, and what are these endpoints that will bring about its end? And do remember one thing, out of all three books, no character references any modern day person (as to not date the books perhaps) except Donald Trump is mentioned by name as an example of the absolute worst identification of taker culture.
highlights of the Ben Corey Piece
Daniel 7:23 fourth beast being from fourth kingdom, which shall be diverse from all the kingdoms…devours the whole earth, treads it down, and breaks it into pieces. USA is diverse, consumes most, horrible to environment
Daniel 7:8 7:4 & Revelations 13:5 13:2 6:2. 11:12
spare all the scripture, but they all point to the antichrist (the supreme taker?) as a non royal ie political outsider, obsessed with winning, known by non followers as a rampant liar, wins over crowds with boastful arrogant speeches, harms everyone who betrays him, and always promised things greater than his rivals
Daniel 11:23
after an alliance is made with him he will practice deception and will go up and gain power with a small force of people. ?are these his small cohort of diehard powerful followers
revelation 13:3
the whole world will follow him - on twitter for sure
Daniel 7:25 he will try and change laws and set times 11:24 he will make his friends wealthy
2 thess. 2:9 religious leaders of the day will say he was sent by god - Franklin graham did already billy graham’s son)
Daniel 8:25 Thess 2:10 - these scriptures basically say that he will change the perception of what is believed as real and what is not – plays well into the Trump phenom of “fake news”, denials and truth altering
Daniel 13:9 - take land away from the people - BLM land out west
revelation 13 5-6 blasphemy, which trump got in trouble for and was televised
there is much more but it gets off narrative of trump as a possible be-all end-all taker supreme

there is a scripture part that he will clear away the temple, and desecrate it , like trump tear gassed all those people to get that photo op at a church that wasn’t his and held someone else bible upside down and backwards as a PR stunt for his evangelical base.

so here are my questions
what would Ishmael interpret the point of revelations, Daniel , etc the apocalyptic stuff that is codified by this worst of all people the “antichrist”?

is that story the story of how the taker culture collapses or starts to collapse? when this world has produced the most taker-ish taker, and his followers all follow in his footsteps to accelerate the end of the world as we know it, like accelerating climate change, sexism, racism, poverty, starvation etc (keystones of takers way of life)

maybe trump is the antichrist / dark taker lord, or maybe its the next dude worse than him sometime in the future. but! do the apocalyptic bible stories and descriptions in the texts (properly interpreted of course) provide or add value to gauging where the civilization is headed


Sure, this is good insight, I am glad to see those observations pointed out. And Trump in power over America currently is certainly with being AntiEarth, and it sets him up for being an antichrist certainly, this earth with us are going to be having so much trouble, and the coming collapse really soon, if he remains in office, which he might hold onto beyond term limits that have been in place, for “emergencies”. Daniel is a good place to see what things can come, and Revelation is, as you mention. Have you considered that Mystery Babylon in Revelation 18 is showing what is coming to civilization? It clearly connects to it from what I see.

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Wow. Just read that Section . “Merchants of the earth have become rich through the abundance of her luxuries”. That scripture is an excellent example of the end of our current way of life, the end of taker culture, because there is nothing left to take.
I always liked this Native American quote from sitting bull and think of it along the same lines, “the love of possessions is a disease within them”.
That disease will, like all diseases, kill us directly or make us so fragile that allows something else to kill us.
I would say that the end of our taker story that we tell ourselves is close to the end. No real apocalypse (in the way many Christians would believe), but the apocalypse of taker way of live.

I see the coming collapse of civilization, which is brought closer with ruining the world further from this current administration with more exploitation of the world without restraint, while so many of Christian believers follow and support Trump in power not even seeing that, like they are devoted followers in a cult. We can understand the fall of civilization will necessarily come, which corresponds to the fall of Mystery Babylon, but we still should not want the world to be made much worse with this, which Revelation 11:18 warns against, but which would happen if votes keep Trump in power. It will really go badly for all, in civilization and away from it, and the world generally, in that case. We should not let that happen without involvement against that.

I’m not saying Donald Trump isnt the Antichrist, but I think Ishmael brought up the early parts of the Bible because they represent the Leaver explanation of how civilization came to be.

The later parts are simply a product of civilization, an attempt to tell civilized people how they should live since the Law of Nature “doesn’t apply to them”. Perhaps even way back then some people realized what a prison civilization is & saw that it would destroy the world? There are definitely some strong environmental arguments made in the book at the core of Taker culture.

“And the nations were angry; and Thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that Thou shouldest give reward unto Thy servants the prophets, and to the saints and them that fear Thy name, small and great, and shouldest destroy them that destroy the earth.”
Revelations 11:18

The meek shall inherit the earth. I would say unequivocally that the civilized world would classify the meek as native indigenous people, possible homeless, but those who can survive if not thrive on nothing.

We can’t tell if Trump fits the described Antichrist, but with filling a role as deceiver with being a big part of the destructiveness to the earth, which God hates as Revelation 11:18, which you point out, communicates, he may easily be imagined as going in that direction, otherwise he precedes someone worse.

I think further parts after the first part of the Bible are more than a product of civilization, though certainly written by men within civilization, I actually do not find support of civilization communicated in the rest of the Bible. Nature applies because we are told to be good stewards in this earth. I think what is said about Mystery Babylon applies to all civilization, that from which God’s people within it must be called out. In talking with Christian believers, who always disagree with many of my positions, I have almost given up on talking about the harm to this world and that civilization cannot go on, so we should learn to live without it. I am now starting off with using the passages of Revelation and telling such who I speak to that this is Mystery Babylon, where we are. It is contrary to God and God never meant it to be or permitted it, and they need to be called out from it. I am hoping for more responsiveness to that.

This is well said. The greedy for using the earth’s resources are not the ones who will be left to inherit the earth. The meek would necessarily be such who, among other things, leave the earth to thrive instead of just taking from it. That’s a good passage to remember.

This world is coming to a critical change. It is not about the demise of just industrial society, and that is coming anyway, with systems in civilization collapsing. The wildfires that are out of control are from hotter and more arid conditions in those places that we have from anthropogenic climate change, as are the more of greater hurricanes and sea storms. Ice is melting in the arctic rapidly, there are islands already sinking as the sea level is rising. Trump is ignoring climate scientists and is permitting all the industries that are destructive to environments and polluting with more carbon going into the air to continue unrestricted. The Democratic candidate and lawmakers are ready to work with the scientists to have policies in place to reduce all that significantly soon. With Trump continuing and none of that happening, nothing can protect this planet with all its natural environments from the destructiveness from what continues from Trump in office. Watch all of this video. It is all the natural world that is being destroyed with civilization’s coming collapse, that will be the difference, and that is what we cannot just let happen. If he is still in office, he would need to be removed quickly. It cannot just continue. This world is really at stake.

And we should be getting out of this, which corresponds to the Mystery Babylon depicted, as soon as we can. We just want a world where most life would still survive, even after civilization would collapse. So Trump has to be gone, right away, for that.