I’ve dropped out of highschool when 16 and never looked back. I’ve done all my learning after that by seeking out whatever interested me at the moment and i dare say that served me well.
for an interesting perspective http://reactor-core.org/deschooling
Absolutely. I just think I could get into the community without paying tuition and taking classes… just by living in a place.
Also, I’ll add that for me college has been four years of unlearning a lot of the lessons I grew up with, say, “rewilding” without the label. I’ve only recently arrived at understanding “rewilding” as something I have been and want to continue doing. If a person is already at this point before college, I think they may not be served very well by university.
While I think most people who've gone through university would agree with you that most learning takes place outside of class, I think it also bears mentioning that those encounters would not have happened without the context of those classes. The tuition pays less for the class itself than the general milieu you get to participate in.
Yea, one of the best things I learned from my advisor was after his archaeology class one day. I stuck around and talked with him for an hour about how the construction of highways was really a sign of an unstable society, since they needed ways to import goods they weren’t making themselves. If you take this beyond simple roadways and look also at shipping routes over sea and air, it suggest something about our society that most of us rewilders aren’t surprised about at all.
I feel most of what my teachers lecture on I can get from the book, though with programming… I learn mostly from my fellow classmates, the theory of it all I can get from the book.
I feel way to locked in with university and school in general, I always want to learn well… what I want to learn at the moment, and I so while going to school I also try to learn the stuff I actually want to in my free time, but with school and work and such… well… it takes me awhile to even read a book now. And then I also want to get outside and do such but… hardly any time either…
Oh well, I try to make the best of it that I can for now, no use getting all worked up about it again.
I’ve never gone to a “real” university, just community college. My experience is that most people care more about grades than learning. They just want to get the piece of paper so they can make more money at their jobs.
The reason I want to go to university is so that I will be taken seriously by wider society.
I’ve found that if you read a lot of books and talk like an educated person, people just assume that you have a university degree.
It’s a mixed bag for me. In college I unlearned a lot from high school, but a lot of things that I “learned” in college I’m finding I have to unlearn as I rewild. And in college, people generally weren’t all that interested in participating with nature, even the environmentalists (and there were a lot of those in my college). In high school there were people all around me who liked to fish and hunt and have that kind of direct experience, even though they weren’t all that interested in the environmental movement.
Starfish, I have a different experience of higher education. There were three main types of students at my college: those who didn’t care about learning, those who cared about grades AND learning, and those who cared about learning, grades be damned. Percentage-wise, I’d say it ran about 10%-65%-25% respectively.
I understand that it’s hard to believe that 90% of my college classmates cared about learning, and the only explanation I can offer is that this particular college is an exceptionally rare specimen. It had very high academic standards, and it was small, with lots of interpersonal academic exchanges between professors and students (there was no graduate program; it was a “teaching college”). In fact there was an exact total of ONE prof who asked the students to call him “Professor So-and-so” and not by his first name, and (for that and many, many other reasons) it was unanimously agreed that he was a pompous jerk.
Some of my college profs I still consider good friends. When I was experiencing emotional/psychological chaos my senior year of college (four years ago), I even went to one of them to get things off my chest. She listened with care and helped me decide to find short-term counseling, and she took it upon herself to check in with me and ask me how I was doing. A great teacher, friend, and mentor in my life.
So speaking from my experiences, I happen to agree with Jason that higher education can provide a great milieu for learning how to think for yourself and value your capacity to think. As rewilders I think we can all appreciate the significance of context. 
“Education is the ability to listen to almost anything without losing your temper or your self-confidence.”
-Robert Frost
Starfish, I agree, but sounding smart usually isn’t enough to persuade parents to allow you to educate their children or to allow you to be a city planner.
Oh, so I read more of this thread, and I wanted to respond to Billy’s original question.
Well, personally I discovered leaving civilization as a goal in and of itself after I finished college.
Some of the people here who are currently students might have begun school before deciding that they want to rewild.
Everybody has to choose how they will rewild, which includes how they will move forward from their present situation: how they will participate in the civilized world while they are working on rewilding, whether it’s choosing not to go to school and going straight into the workforce or going to school to do something more specialized in the workforce.
I can see myself going back to school and getting a degree in psychology, becoming a therapist, and eventually leaving that role as I step further into rewilding (however, it would certainly make the rewilding process longer). Both of those goals would be worthwhile to me. I mean, if I have to engage with civ for the time being, I should make it work for me as best I can, right? And I imagine if I live a very frugal lifestyle, I can get those loans paid off faster. Once the loans are paid off, I can start taking fewer clients (or patients, depending on how you look at it) and spend MORE of my time rewilding. I can eventually phase the therapy work out altogether.
That’s all assuming that I have the time. Civ could crash quickly. But then again, a lot of things could happen. I could cross the street this afternoon and get hit by a car.
Sigh, I haven’t really worked out my long-term goals yet, and all I know so far is that leaving civ for rewilding is the ultimate goal.
Heyvic.,
I know what you mean, while at the same time lately I’ve thought a lot about going for a doctorate.
Actually, though it requires a higher degree of education, jazz is actually a very free and communal form of music. So yeah, jazz music is much less hierarchical and restrictive than say, Bach. It’s a hell of a lot easier to get a group of your friends to pick a standard tune and just jam for 20 minutes than it is to organize a chamber quartet. Also, through soloing, it’s a very individually expressive medium.
So is it rewilding? Sort of. But specially hammered brass and wooden reeds from the Andes mountains (yes, sax players actually have those) are not long for this world. So I have to figure out new ways of getting that spirit into a more rewilded context.
Yes, I guess I have more the spirit of jazz in mind than the specific instruments one usually plays. I see jazz as an excellent way to rewild–it already moves Western music in concert with wild African music, so it makes an excellent bridge.
I’ve started thinking of it this way, too. Artists are (in)famous for looking at the world from the outside in. I think it’d be easy to convince an artist of the merits of rewilding. Seems as though you’re already convinced. 
Do you need a high degree of education to play jazz? As one who has played beginning level jazz piano, I know there’s a lot to learn if you want to play it well. But you can learn jazz from experience, with other musicians, without a formal course of study.
Of course if you want to teach, that’s a different story. 8) (<— hepcat sunglasses ;))
Speaking of wild African music, the banjo is an adaptation of an African tribal instrument. So American folk/bluegrass music is also a possible bridge for rewilding.
[quote=“BlueHeron, post:21, topic:818”][quote author=Django link=topic=869.msg9658#msg9658 date=1208298193]
art (an inherently non-civilized pastime).
[/quote]
I’ve started thinking of it this way, too. Artists are (in)famous for looking at the world from the outside in. I think it’d be easy to convince an artist of the merits of rewilding. Seems as though you’re already convinced.
Do you need a high degree of education to play jazz? As one who has played beginning level jazz piano, I know there’s a lot to learn if you want to play it well. But you can learn jazz from experience, with other musicians, without a formal course of study.
Of course if you want to teach, that’s a different story. 8) (<— hepcat sunglasses ;))
Speaking of wild African music, the banjo is an adaptation of an African tribal instrument. So American folk/bluegrass music is also a possible bridge for rewilding.[/quote]
It depends. The idea of getting a college degree in jazz music would have been considered absurd a few decades ago. Some of the greats didn’t even attend college at all. A crucial part of jazz education is great players teaching other players on a personal basis.
The concept of teaching jazz music is abstract. You can teach the theory, melodic passages that sound good, resolution, appropriate rhythmic patterns, etc. but at the end of the day, the teacher wants to get the YOU out of your playing. Jazz as a form of music and as an art form is a matter of speaking the language of jazz. But like Shakespeare is different than Joyce is different than e.e. cummings is different Chuck Palinhuik, nobody is going to speak the same language the same way.
Jason, you’re actually dead on. My interpretation of jazz musicians from the 1950’s on is that they were (and are) the most dangerous artists alive: people with the musical knowledge and expertise of classical musicians with the wild, sexual, natural and beautiful creative urge of folk musicians.
[quote=“Django, post:22, topic:818”][quote author=BlueHeron link=topic=869.msg9699#msg9699 date=1208396805]
Do you need a high degree of education to play jazz? As one who has played beginning level jazz piano, I know there’s a lot to learn if you want to play it well. But you can learn jazz from experience, with other musicians, without a formal course of study.
[/quote]
It depends. The idea of getting a college degree in jazz music would have been considered absurd a few decades ago. Some of the greats didn’t even attend college at all. A crucial part of jazz education is great players teaching other players on a personal basis.[/quote]
That was a rhetorical question (see above), but thanks for elaborating anyway!
Sorry Matt, I guess I did not understand what you meant about people taking you seriously.
That’s cool starfish, this format can be annoying sometimes.
[quote=“Neighbor Scout, post:18, topic:818”]Heyvic.,
I know what you mean, while at the same time lately I’ve thought a lot about going for a doctorate. [/quote]
Neighbor Scout,
What field would you get your doctorate in?
There are some things that I want to get done, now that I am here. Since I am born into this society, i need at least someone who can teach me primitive skills. NOt the basic ones, but theharder ones such as medical care etc. I lack those skills, at least its not enough to support myslef. Also I would very much like to get a group pf people if i were to leave society behind, its easier that way, since some of us have skills others dont etc.
And once i go i have no plan to return, so that would mean I like a lot of other people are waiting for the right girl as well. (Hint to all the girls on this forum :p)
-Tj
I went to community college before I knew about re-wilding and just wanted to get a “good job”. I dropped out when I read Daniel Quinn’s work because that style of learning (read-regurgitate-forget) didn’t work for me. My grades were awful because I spent most of my time in school trying to learn, not memorise things so I could pass a test.
I’m trying to get into a university right now because they actually have some rewilding programs and seminars. They have this “Wild by Nature” class that I want to take simply because I want to learn basketry. http://wildbynature.org/environ.html <-- I could probably figure out a way to do this on my own (I’ve been un-universitying myself since I dropped out) but this university also has a few other things I’m interested in and I figure it’s easier to be an official student than to pay $400 for one class. They also have the Sierra Institute ( http://www.humboldt.edu/~sierra/application.html ) which looks like fun.
But mainly, I’ve had a hard time trying to get a paying job and my family is very frustrated with me for not “doing something” so they’re pushing me to “go back” to school. Sigh. They’re footing the bill, so I don’t care. I tried to explain rewilding and unlearning to them, but they just don’t get it.
So that’s why I’m going to university.
Hi, this is my first post here on this forum. I finish university in a week, I should be studying but I am procrastinating! I studied Biology and Ecology double major and I can honestly say I’ve learnt ALOT about nature, not just the nitty gritty details of genetics, cell biology etc. but broad concepts, ideas, trends in ecology. there are so many misconceptions out there about nature and evolution.
My choice now is, do i do an honours/research year where i get to hopefully work on the reintroduction of locally extinct species, or work/save and drop out/rewild or start a career in conservation. your input is welcome!